Can we please have some honesty and transparency?

[Cstove 374]

Just now, RuneScape said:

What the game Nine to Five RPG has accomplished in 2 months means they are well on track to surpassing identity... Imagine how fast things will speed up if they manage to receive their goal on kickstarter. 

Everyone received an email off Identity about a month ago stating how we're all going to receive multiple emails every month now...  Did we?? No... Why? Because it was just a quick attempt to gain a bunch of extra cash from potential new customers. They hyped up some mafia territory thing and some new pets to peak peoples interest again. We will probably receive a similar email in a few months time with some convenient new cash shop items... again promising lots of emails every month only to go dead after that single one. Wonder what the next news thing will be.... "Introducing planes to travel around the world... Buy your plane now for a limited time before it's gone forever" 

 

 

Nine to five isn’t on Kickstarter anymore they moved to indiegogo, so that even if they don’t meet their goal they get all the money pledged. Also look at identity’s first vid, it has way more with way better graphics, and they had only been working on identity for a few months at that time.

[silentunion 13]

On 2018-08-31 at 6:19 PM, JoelKeys said:

I agree with you here and you have made a genuine criticism, but a lot of the people here are brainwashed and won't see this as a genuine criticism.

 

It's not that people are brainwashed. It's that some people have more patience than others. Because some people don't agree with you, they are brainwashed? Perhaps some people are brainwashed here because they've had everything handed to them on a silver platter via the larger gaming companies, so when it comes to times like these, they whine and complain about a nail being broken or something. However, I'm sure you'd rather not be considered brainwashed either, so why not just understand that people have different opinions?

Anyway, I think what's really happening here is that some people don't understand the development process. You don't just simply create a game and people play it. The development process is long and tedious. I do think they could use a little more transparency; however, it's also a small company and that transparency would likely be really REALLY boring, especially if there's not much new to report.

[lamona 50]

The development definitely needs some serious transparency. Not more talk about transparency, or dismissive (and ultimately meaningless) "things are moving along well now" posts, but a serious indication how things are going. And chances are it's not going well.

As soon as they admitted to no longer adding tasks, the tracker has been rendered as meaningless as the 89% progress bar. No surprise to people with a thread of skepticism, but worrying all the same. It's more disturbing seeing people say "adding more tasks would annoy people, so it makes sense they wouldn't add them" -- what kind of childish thinking is that? 

We're almost six months past the two release dates, and it could well be another six months away. Efforts are put into more ways to make money, like selling concept pugs and divvying up the apartments to lock them behind paywalls, while the module stagnates for another half a year. Priorities are off. If they need more money, we should know about it; if they don't, they're being greedy.

More transparency is needed. Somehow I doubt Identity Insider or whatever it's called is going to be the thing that offers it. But each time a week drifts by unceremoniously, I get more and more concerned about this project...

Edited September 4, 2018 by lamona

[GrumpyReg6657 20]

What the game Nine to Five RPG has accomplished in 2 months means they are well on track to surpassing identity... Imagine how fast things will speed up if they manage to receive their goal on Kickstarter 

Have you seen the way their car moves. looks like it steers from the middle of the car. I don't think its anywhere as good as Identity. and I don't think they have enough money to keep going. if you feel that Nine to Five is better, Go pledge to them and stop moaning about Identity.

 

[Cstove 374]

5 hours ago, GrumpyReg6657 said:

What the game Nine to Five RPG has accomplished in 2 months means they are well on track to surpassing identity... Imagine how fast things will speed up if they manage to receive their goal on Kickstarter 

Have you seen the way their car moves. looks like it steers from the middle of the car. I don't think its anywhere as good as Identity. and I don't think they have enough money to keep going. if you feel that Nine to Five is better, Go pledge to them and stop moaning about Identity.

 

 

I’m so confused your paragraphs contradict each other.

[SamTheAmericanMan 4]

23 hours ago, RuneScape said:

Town square will probably be released sometime next year. But the town square itself is unlikely to offer much entertainment. It would be more about walking around and not doing much other than socializing with other people.  People will get bored of that very fast.  And it's took them this many year just to sort that out. 

 

Not true at all.  TS is the first module that will be released, yes, HOWEVER they haven't spent this entire time working solely on the town square module, rather implementing and building the framework required for all the other modules, and thus, the game.  They have said it themselves that the TS module will be the longest time to wait as they are doing the foundation work for the entire game before releasing and after TS release they expect the other modules to come faster. 

Think about it... Town Square is by far the most intensive module out of all of them as it requires the entire foundation of the game to be made in order to be released in working order.  While on the other hand, the SWAT or racing module only require to build off of that major framework set down by the TS module in order to work.  

[JoelKeys 412]

21 hours ago, silentunion said:

It's not that people are brainwashed. It's that some people have more patience than others. Because some people don't agree with you, they are brainwashed? Perhaps some people are brainwashed here because they've had everything handed to them on a silver platter via the larger gaming companies, so when it comes to times like these, they whine and complain about a nail being broken or something. However, I'm sure you'd rather not be considered brainwashed either, so why not just understand that people have different opinions?

Anyway, I think what's really happening here is that some people don't understand the development process. You don't just simply create a game and people play it. The development process is long and tedious. I do think they could use a little more transparency; however, it's also a small company and that transparency would likely be really REALLY boring, especially if there's not much new to report.

 

Fair enough. I apologise. I believe what I said but should have worded it better, I am just fed up of people wondering why everyone is so annoyed. I am not going to retract my statement about brainwashed people. I am not talking about people who disagree with me, because I actually agree with both sides. I am referring to the people who absolutely refuse to admit any fault on Asylums part and draw every lie and suspicious action down to us 'not being patient' or 'game development takes time'.

No one is saying you just make a game and people play it, but after 3 years we expect a little bit more than what we seem to be getting.

[Sorvete 40]

2 hours ago, Cstove said:

I’m so confused your paragraphs contradict each other.

 

He probably quoted another reply the wrong way...

[Cstove 374]

38 minutes ago, Sorvete said:

He probably quoted another reply the wrong way...

 

Oh you’re right.

[Paratus 2,230]

7 hours ago, SamTheAmericanMan said:

Not true at all.  TS is the first module that will be released, yes, HOWEVER they haven't spent this entire time working solely on the town square module, rather implementing and building the framework required for all the other modules, and thus, the game.  They have said it themselves that the TS module will be the longest time to wait as they are doing the foundation work for the entire game before releasing and after TS release they expect the other modules to come faster. 

Think about it... Town Square is by far the most intensive module out of all of them as it requires the entire foundation of the game to be made in order to be released in working order.  While on the other hand, the SWAT or racing module only require to build off of that major framework set down by the TS module in order to work.  

 

This is very much the case. When it comes to the SWAT module, the mechanics are actually quite simple to create in comparison to the back-end that is the Town Square. The Town Square is just a social module but there's a LOT going on behind the scenes. It is our foundation. 

6 hours ago, JoelKeys said:

Fair enough. I apologise. I believe what I said but should have worded it better, I am just fed up of people wondering why everyone is so annoyed. I am not going to retract my statement about brainwashed people. I am not talking about people who disagree with me, because I actually agree with both sides. I am referring to the people who absolutely refuse to admit any fault on Asylums part and draw every lie and suspicious action down to us 'not being patient' or 'game development takes time'.

No one is saying you just make a game and people play it, but after 3 years we expect a little bit more than what we seem to be getting.

 

Even with my own position, I understand the discontent completely. People are looking for some depth and words only go so far.

The reason we haven't shown off a lot is two-fold: first, the majority of the work going into the Town Square is back-end and foundation work. It's grueling work which unfortunately isn't fun to look at. It's the first bit we need to take care of, but it's not something we can show in a visual sense. Furthermore, giving detailed information on the inner-workings of our foundation code can actually do harm when that information falls into the laps of the wrong people.

The second issue is one of psychology. Anyone who's been following games for much time can attest to the fact that first impressions are the only ones which matter for most people. This doesn't apply to everyone, but it does for the VAST majority of people; even if people understand something is a work-in-progress when they get their hands on it, the impression they get from that experience will persist.

Fortunately, we're coming to the end of the worst wait in this. I know you've heard something like this before, so it's likely taken lightly, but it's looking quite up right now. In fact, we're not far from handing out the Steam keys to prepare for a Steam launch. Our earlier estimates were well off the mark because we ran into some pretty significant issues with the engine. Keep in mind we have a HEAVILY modified version of Unreal Engine 4. We've done some pretty large changes to accommodate a real MMORPG.

I wish it hasn't taken this long, but we're committed to doing this right. We're not going to take shortcuts and release a product which isn't up to our standards. The wait is almost over and you're going to be getting some fun updates quite soon.

[ZanderiusMaximus 56]

i sincerely hope so <3 rooting for it

Edited September 5, 2018 by ZanderiusMaximus

[NskDen 56]

Oh, may be September is TS month 

[Oroborous 40]

On 9/3/2018 at 6:11 PM, silentunion said:

It's not that people are brainwashed. It's that some people have more patience than others. Because some people don't agree with you, they are brainwashed? Perhaps some people are brainwashed here because they've had everything handed to them on a silver platter via the larger gaming companies, so when it comes to times like these, they whine and complain about a nail being broken or something. However, I'm sure you'd rather not be considered brainwashed either, so why not just understand that people have different opinions?

Anyway, I think what's really happening here is that some people don't understand the development process. You don't just simply create a game and people play it. The development process is long and tedious. I do think they could use a little more transparency; however, it's also a small company and that transparency would likely be really REALLY boring, especially if there's not much new to report.

 

It's not about thing being handed on a silver platter.  Weather you like it or not there must be some kind of industry standards...The constant excuse of Asylum being a indie developer, or that it's their first game won't fly anymore, This excuse got old and got abused too much.  Obviously they are digging themselves a bigger hole and they are doing it to themselves.  Maybe that is the idea,  game is too ambitious so let's get the pledged money and take off.  The forums have been buzzing for a while and they have no clarified much at this point.  In terms of patience i have been patient since the kick starter was announced and at this point i would like to hold Asylum accountable and have things clarified. 

[Oroborous 40]

1 hour ago, FCTwente said:

Have seen some of ur messages in this forum, damn dude, you're such a pessimist. If you're still not impressed by what they have show'n (off identity) than you shouldn't be here at all.

 

What have they shown? Models? , Broken physics? Everyone says we seen game play, Well i am not sure that running around a level with few buildings, couple of models and few visual effects can be labeled as game play.  Perhaps they would still have to connect certain systems together in order to make things work properly, but as it stands right now it's not really game play.  As i said before i would not care about town square release since people will get bored very quick, but give us some info,  show us how you work on this, share a bit of the development like most of the companies do. 

[dagtag 201]

1 hour ago, Oroborous said:

What have they shown? Models? , Broken physics? Everyone says we seen game play, Well i am not sure that running around a level with few buildings, couple of models and few visual effects can be labeled as game play.  Perhaps they would still have to connect certain systems together in order to make things work properly, but as it stands right now it's not really game play.  As i said before i would not care about town square release since people will get bored very quick, but give us some info,  show us how you work on this, share a bit of the development like most of the companies do. 

 

gameplay: the features of a video game, such as its plot and the way it is played, as distinct from the graphics and sound effects.

you don't just decide what is/isn't gameplay, it is literally in the name GAME PLAY.

did they show off the graphics? check

did they play the game? check

what other features do you want them to show from TS? ts is a social module, there is nothing else to show... just showing of everything woud mean there is no point exploring TS yourself... they played the game and showed it off --> gameplay

[Oroborous 40]

1 hour ago, dagtag said:

gameplay: the features of a video game, such as its plot and the way it is played, as distinct from the graphics and sound effects.

you don't just decide what is/isn't gameplay, it is literally in the name GAME PLAY.

did they show off the graphics? check

did they play the game? check

what other features do you want them to show from TS? ts is a social module, there is nothing else to show... just showing of everything woud mean there is no point exploring TS yourself... they played the game and showed it off --> gameplay

 

I can't believe you're accepting that as a game play.  You can achieve running around a city in few weeks.

[GrumpyReg6657 20]

23 hours ago, Cstove said:

I’m so confused your paragraphs contradict each other.

for some reason it didn't quote. prob me. 

[dagtag 201]

36 minutes ago, Oroborous said:

I can't believe you're accepting that as a game play.  You can achieve running around a city in few weeks.

 

it is gameplay nonetheless, there is no use in speaking of "accepting it as gameplay" it IS gameplay, who are you to say it isn't? a pledger? because that doesn't just give you the right to demand to see more from these gameplays. so answer my question, what else could they have shown us? a movie in the cinema? singing some karaoke? playing some chess? accept it, these are things that the player needs to explore for himself and don't belong in a gameplay video.

[Cstove 374]

12 minutes ago, GrumpyReg6657 said:

for some reason it didn't quote. prob me. 

 

Oh okay makes sense.

[Dandi 17]

Honestly speaking, I have faith that by the end of this month it'll be up & ready. If I'm wrong, then, well.. honestly, I'll still wait patiently, I just prefer having my own mini-dates and a very small expectation to keep myself in this game as long as I've got 0 access to it. Lol, but that's just me.

[mezdoo 60]

dayum fanboys defending devs again

[Oroborous 40]

2 hours ago, dagtag said:

it is gameplay nonetheless, there is no use in speaking of "accepting it as gameplay" it IS gameplay, who are you to say it isn't? a pledger? because that doesn't just give you the right to demand to see more from these gameplays. so answer my question, what else could they have shown us? a movie in the cinema? singing some karaoke? playing some chess? accept it, these are things that the player needs to explore for himself and don't belong in a gameplay video.

 

Actually as a "pledger" i get to demand.  Who is saying i can not you? We all can because we invested real MONEY into this project, Without any of us it would not exist. That is "powerful"   So get your head from wherever it is and stop telling people they are  not allowed to demand and hold those they invested in accountable. We all have a voice in this.  Trust me if my money is involved in something i will as questions simply because you don't live my life, you don't pay my bills, and most importantly you do not work my job and get paid for my effort at it.  You want to pretend to be a fan boy and tell people they can't voice their opinions? give your best try cause not every single individual here is half asleep.  Maybe it's time you get a reality check cause you going to get checked by those that pledged their money.  There are people who invested a lot and by all means not every person here screams "mommy" and their parent's bank account opens up with a cash flow.   With the whole disaster Asylum got itself they can fix this by doing something that can give people a better insight on what's going on.   You yourself mentioned tons of time by now pointing that most information can be obtained via discord, well this does not make it official,  Joe tells Mark,  Mark misunderstood what Joe said and tells Fred something else and it's a ever going circle of a mess.  I know you want the best for the game, I think all of us do. But there are ways of ding things properly and that is a reason why you got a lot of people pissed off,  It's not the fact that it's taking a while, but the inconsistency of what they promise vs what do we see happen.  

[dagtag 201]

1 minute ago, Oroborous said:

Actually as a "pledger" i get to demand.  Who is saying i can not you? We all can because we invested real MONEY into this project, Without any of us it would not exist. That is "powerful"   So get your head from wherever it is and stop telling people they are  not allowed to demand and hold those they invested in accountable. We all have a voice in this.  Trust me if my money is involved in something i will as questions simply because you don't live my life, you don't pay my bills, and most importantly you do not work my job and get paid for my effort at it.  You want to pretend to be a fan boy and tell people they can't voice their opinions? give your best try cause not every single individual here is half asleep.  Maybe it's time you get a reality check cause you going to get checked by those that pledged their money.  There are people who invested a lot and by all means not every person here screams "mommy" and their parent's bank account opens up with a cash flow.   With the whole disaster Asylum got itself they can fix this by doing something that can give people a better insight on what's going on.   You yourself mentioned tons of time by now pointing that most information can be obtained via discord, well this does not make it official,  Joe tells Mark,  Mark misunderstood what Joe said and tells Fred something else and it's a ever going circle of a mess.  I know you want the best for the game, I think all of us do. But there are ways of ding things properly and that is a reason why you got a lot of people pissed off,  It's not the fact that it's taking a while, but the inconsistency of what they promise vs what do we see happen.  

 

there are a couple things wrong with your comment, you lach out at me because you worked hard for your money? well guess what so did I but that doesn't matter, you cant demand everything you want, pledging into an idea doesn't mean you buy your way into the company it shows you support the idea and the developers behind it. and you calling us pledgers "powerful" shows that you for one are abusing that power. calling their footage "not gameplay" is not holding someone accountable...

again, answer my question, WHAT MORE CAN THEY SHOW. this is the third time i asked this and you don't seem to come up with an answer, and you know what? I think I know why, you don't know the answer do you. you simply demand demand demand and once someone points out that they cant simply show more you just change subjects, just admit that there is nothing else for them to show, is it that hard?

[LordBenji 210]

Okay things are getting a tad heated in my opinion.

First of all, when we pledge, we should understands the risks and rewards. Also, pledges are for supporting the developers financially for working on the project. I'm pretty sure we all came here because we like the idea. But the issue I often see is that people pledge, then the development doesn't abide by their standards, and the content isn't delivered in due time.

As for the game-play, it may not have been much, but they wanted to show off that Town Square was a thing. They also did show some sneak peak of a few features. Will it get boring after a while? Perhaps. I'm pretty sure a lot of people are more interested in the full game experience instead.

In terms of showing off what's being done, I'm pretty sure renderings of assets aren't enough. But John did mention already in this thread about why he doesn't show the back-end/code/programming side of things. So I'm not quite sure what else he could show... I know John and Beach_ball mentioned there will be an insider about prisons coming soon(tm).

Personally, I have also pledged into Identity RPG. I first got the Founders package back in December 2016, and worked my way up to Speed Demon. And more recently, I also pledged for some additional rewards in the shop. That's my choice to give support to the developers. It doesn't really grant me anything apart from those rewards included in those pledges. I think we are all equal, whether we invest money or not.

No one is forbidden to ask questions or to give an opinion. But the way we phrase it does matter. Not everyone likes to read tense discussions.

I'll finish with this. John has already mentioned that he owes an apology, plus he actually did apologize during the latest Q&A video made by Identity QG (French community). I was also surprised he had time to stay a bit longer than expected to answer community questions. I'll link the unlisted video below (beware, it might be a little difficult to understand the French guys speaking):

 

[Masa 34]

Idk what kind lvl of delusion is that

First impression? Already done, shady project that never coming out, so much time and money and so little done... if somebody think peoples change their minds because almost empty TS gonna be released in a bit better state than other EA games is wrong. Everyone gonna look behind and "vote" biased on that,  rage after release will be huge.

Bugs free alpha? Who in the world aiming to release experimental build without bugs? It's hilarious, AAA titles from under best studios after years of development have lots of bugs in the beginning, thousands of peoples playing will always test it better and quicker than few programmers. Never gonna happen, i can bet now that TS going to be bugged and unpolished